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Jack White is always willing to overlook others' faults, and he sometimes overdoes his charitableness. That really worked out right.
Because he never really talked about sin that much. Yeah, yeah, of course! And I mean that for the better -- it's not like I'm suffering in any way.
- Jack White has had an encounter with 2009. And even the President of Italy sang the song and everything.
I had waited several months to get on a plane to Nashville so I could spend a bit of quality time with the most important musician working these days. It was a million degrees, I was trapped inside a marathon and had to walk up and down the parched, hilly streets in very high heels to reach my destination. I was a tad late, but Jack was charming and accommodating, pushing his next meeting back so we could have a cozy chat. He was exquisite in a sheer skintight black t-shirt, his black hair messy and his charisma massive. It was just after 11 AM and Jack White was already in the center of his day. Pamela- So why do you get up early? Jack- I like to get up early. I did that when I was in my 20s, get up at noon or 2:00, and then the whole day is gone. You miss the whole day. The daytime people are so much more inspiring like that… the contractors on their way to work. P- Paul Reubens told me he got to see your upholstery equipment JW- Yeah, he was in my shop! I talked to him yesterday. P- He said it was amazing. You have it right in your house and you actually still do it. Does it keep you in touch with the real world or something? P- So you can imagine things while your physically doing it? P- My god-daughter was so thrilled I was coming here today, she was beside herself. Yeah, are you kidding? Yeah, yeah, of course! I thought you were going to say Alan Parsons! JW- Was it last year? P- No, it was about three years ago. She finally got Keith Richards and Norah Jones… JW- Oh, yeah, yeah, I saw that! P- She tried to get you to do it. JW- I know, I was on tour! People want to know, how the fuck you can with two kids, and a wife, and being a producer, and running this thing and having three bands? Do you stretch time? Sometimes I feel like I can stretch time. P- Why does it take six hours? Because you do it the old-fashioned way? P- Just like the old way. You remind me of Frank Zappa, he was my mentor, because you do so much and you do it in the old fashioned way. JW- Did you ever… I suppose you… of course you hung out with Beefheart, too? P- In fact his cousin turned me on to Dylan. Victor went to my high school. Victor, the Mascara Snake? He is one of my best friends in the world… changed my fucking life. But then he turned me on to Dylan and the Stones and his cousin while I was in high school. P- He was the first person I met in Hollywood and he told me I was a gas. Victor said he knew you were by listening to your music. JW- I have one of his paintings, too. P- You know Victor paints. So when did you last see Beefheart? His wife keeps him secluded. JW- In the desert? Well, he likes it up there. I saw him maybe 12 years ago. He had an art show, his last art show, and he was in a wheelchair then. P- It was great to see him. He changed my life. JW- Oh, I bet. P- Now who turned you on to him? JW- I was in a band called the Go in Detroit, and the other guitar player came over and had the BBC documentary John Peel made about Beefheart. P- The first album… JW- Oh God. P- God, I love that. JW- Ohhh my God, I still play that over and over again. Every time I play that I have to play that. With both those guys, the drummer got me into them. He made it all up. JW- Yeah, it just comes from… P- Such an amazing place, it came from. So who turned you onto Dylan? P- That is so interesting. When did you find out how important that was? JW- What the family? P- No, the seventh son part! I remember singing that when I was three or four years old. P- You were lucky. So your older brothers were into it? JW- Yeah, they had the records and were playing them for me. P- Because I remember the life changing moment when Victor turned me onto Dylan, the first album. JW- The very first with him holding the guitar? I played the entire first Bob Dylan record from start to finish, all the time. JW- You know those silver toned amp and case models where your amp is in the guitar case? I played through that and sang at those coffee shops, all those songs. That was my gateway even more, that folk. And sometimes when I let myself enjoy it, it almost makes it go away, it almost makes people turned off. JW- I made a conscious decision… Oh good. P- Do you get completely nervous before events like that one, or are you centered when those kinds of things happen? Well, what about excitement? JW- These are always the questions where I feel like I should lie. Then people are like, whoa, whoa, slow down, man. That really worked out right. P- Yeah, I figured. Were you an altar boy? P- How did that happen? JW- They came and filmed it at my church, my school. The school I went to was this huge complex and the writer of the book lived in my neighborhood in Southwest Detroit. P- And you were so darn cute they wanted you, right? But there was another altar boy that got to drop the cross on the priest. He was to fall asleep and drop the cross on the priest and I wanted to be that kid really bad. P- Why did you want to do that? Just for the dramatic aspect of it? JW- The other boy was a part of it. He was a part of what was happening. He was creating and I was an innocent bystander holding a candle nearby. So were you a Jesus person as a kid? JW- My dad was born again and my mom was a hard-nose Catholic, but by the time I had grown up things had changed for my family religiously, but not the family make-up at all. But it was a lot of Christian group battleground growing up. P- So you stepped away from it? JW- Yeah, because I think it was a remnant of a past thing. My parents are from the depression, they had me when they were really old. My parents were senior citizens when I was a kid. P- But do you align Jesus with God, at all? JW- Yeah, I sort of default to Jesus. Do you know what I mean? JW- I pray to God. P- You pray to God, to actual God. And how do you see God? As the whole world, do you see all of us as a piece of God? Like I see all of us as a piece of God and we all, everything makes up God. JW- Yeah, yeah, yeah, I think so too. We can only take the wood that he put here and make something out of it. P- Do you think that you need to be a good person because of aligning with the God spirit? Are you just naturally a good person do you think, or do you work at it? P- Yeah, but I always try to answer it. I always try to go there, always try to blow up things, you know. Is that something you have to go after, or does it just come to you? Or is it always there, or do you have to work at it? Because I write books and I have to sit my butt in a chair, but I do everything in this world to avoid that. You know how you feel that with some people? JW- Oh thank you. That makes me feel good. P- And this place, my God! JW- What do you think? P- God, you must be so excited… the actual master of your domain kind of thing. I sort of stumbled into the building and I thought, wow, this is pretty much just big enough to do all these things if we space it out. P- Yeah, you can incorporate all of it. And this is the only picture of him, this was like a blow up of it. They found a full version of the full body. P- Look at his expression. He and Son House drove to Wisconsin to record and Son House stole his girl, Son House sat in the back seat with his wife. Took his wife on the drive there. P- Wow, what a song. JW- And they go and record together the next day. P- So you love musical history obviously. Do you read all those biographies on people? Those are the sort of books I like to read, factual, things that really happened. And at the same time I get scared. I get scared because I know I could go into it and have a hundred thousand of them. You know what I mean? JW- Yeah, same with producing records. It was too close to me. Oh I loved it so much. You just go there? I totally want to see that. JW- That might be it. P- And not as much known so you can fill in the blanks. JW- Yeah, fill in the blanks maybe. JW- There was two and they just found a third one. It was in Vanity Fair a couple months ago, it was crazy. And he looks so good. He got in trouble for that I guess. JW- What I hate is they made a stamp of the one Robert Johnson photo but they airbrushed the cigarette out of his mouth. P- Paul McCartney, too. So what made you choose Nashville? The red, red state of Tennessee? JW- I think all together the south just felt comfortable to me. But I just gave up; I just had to move down. I just had to give up and finally do it. JW- Yeah, yeah, SO HAPPY, I really love it here. JW- Yeah, I had to just invest in something solid and this town just feels so right, not too big, not too small. They respect music even the plastic side of Nashville, the plastic country and western side of things, whatever that means, the bigger picture though is that they respect musicians here a lot. You know what I mean? P- Do you go out? Do you go see bands? I did that in Detroit and I was just in it. Eat, slept, thought, drank and ate it. P- Do people bug you? P- Yeah, I would think so, there are so many musicians here it might be easier. It must just be great! Are you feeling very happy about your life? You have the best sense of humor in the world. What makes you think that? JW- Oh, okay, that sense of humor! Do you remember when you felt that you were going to do music for your life? Do you remember that moment or whatever it was that you felt this was what you were going to do? Or is it just something innate and you thought you were going to be a musician from day one? Or was your goal to be an upholsterer to start with? Even when the White Stripes started going out on shows, I was still thinking, obviously this is music that people could care less about. These two people, brother and sister, blues band dressing in red, white and black doing this and this, with peppermint on the bass drum and acting like little children. Not extra ambitious, but realistic, you know? P- Accepting of reality. And you obviously were doing it so you did believe in it, right? P- So I put a lot of stock in that statement. JW- It really is. And I think maybe it gets misunderstood by people because of it. I said something to one of the guys in the Raconteurs last year when we were on tour. The focus of it? JW- Yeah, I guess. I think Kurt Cobain wrecked it. I mean I love him, but I think he wrecked rock fashion for a very long time. And I noticed right away that you guys were dressing up, that this is so important. Remember how the Who used to dress up? It made you want to be there and love it and observe it and get inspired yourself to look cool. Why I should trust them or care about their opinion. Not that you have to be famous to be believed. JW- I want the people I idolize to take themselves very seriously. Do you know what I mean? But I mean do you want Dylan to not take himself seriously? I want him to have the self respect, so that… Like you were talking about. If you respect yourself, then maybe others can respect you, too. Dylan read my first book and told me I was a good writer one time. Everything he represents alone, is like a joining of the family just to have a conversation. And I was like, oh my God! And it happened in five minutes and that song came out. It was so cool. I was so thankful to be an antenna like that for a second. Because Hank wrote the song, let it be an antenna again. JW- It was an accident. JW- Tammy Wynette bought his house after he died. Tammy Wynette sort of made it into this giant ranch home, that almost looks like a church office. I wanna find out where all them songs were. P- They were just words, and you wrote the music? P- So you got to write with Hank Williams? I want to write that down on a piece of paper and frame it. Are you going to produce other bands besides your own? JW- Yeah I have a bunch of projects now. This is a part of this whole system. How about Axl Rose spending 11-years on his record? What was the first live show that you saw, do you remember? P- Wow, are you lucky! How old were you? JW- Ten years old and I had seat 666, I remember. The one they have the recording of? P- Yes, and I have it on vinyl because I was there! When did you get into him? What were your favorite movies of his? And how were you able to use those lyrics? Did you have to legally obtain them? JW- That was a pretty big strange debacle. First I worked at the FOX Theater in Detroit as a bus boy when I was a teenager, and on my breaks I got to go see the shows. And they had a re-showing of Citizen Kane. The song was when we were on a tiny little indie label when we were selling a thousand records, and I looked all over to find who wrote the lyrics that I used. Then we got signed to a major label and it got put out worldwide and all of the sudden… So now 50% of the song goes to some 90-year old lady. It was meant to be a tribute. But this is also for Rolling Stone Italy. And even the President of Italy sang the song and everything. I wanted to fly there and see it, because it was a chant in the streets of Italy. P- That is amazing! JW- It was quite amazing. My friend was on a beach in the Mediterranean and a cruise ship went by and the people on the boat were chanting the riff of the song and the people on the beach were answering them back, going back and forth. But they used the prettiest picture of me and Meg on the cover of that Rolling Stone. We had taken a photo for the American Rolling Stone, and they used a bad one, they always do. But they used the best one for the Italian one. I was scared of you when I saw that book when I was a twelve years old. P- Yeah, I guess I was outrageous back then. JW- But redheads have always attracted and repelled me magnetically at the same time. P- I was going to say how far back does that go? JW- Oh God, it goes back to that, yeah. JW- Maybe so, maybe so. JW- What do you think of Monica Bellucci doing that? Have you red the Gospel According to Mary Magdalene. You are so cool! P- And the Gospel According to Thomas. P- And the Gospel According to Jesus by Stephen Mitchell? Let me write it down. P- It might be my favorite book because it changes peoples lives. Do you know Todd Snider by any chance? Do you know his music? I turned Todd onto Stephen Mitchell and he said it just changed everything for him. Because he never really talked about sin that much. JW- What do you mean? JW- Sin means being separated from God. P- Yes, the original meaning for it in that language is separation from God, which is impossible. JW- Oh, okay, yeah. P- Well, he was his brother. JW- Yeah, but the idea of Satan cannot only be some evil figure or whatever, but the idea of that is beneath all of this is get behind me, get with me on it. P- You know I never even thought of it that way? JW- Yeah, yeah, right. I was very impressed with that title. JW- Yeah, I had to take the thee out just to exemplify the double meaning. JW- Whoa, thank you. And sometimes you can get away with it or not. P- It depends on how you follow the cliché phrase up, or what you say right before it.
Cut for Time: Wedding Toast - SNL
At times, Jack White feels lonely or isolated, even when he is with people. Because he never really talked about sin that much. JW- Yeah, because I think it was a remnant of a past thing. David Fricke's 2011 list ranked him at medico 17. P- Why did you want to do that. P- So you can imagine things while your physically doing it. Remember how the Who used to dress up. You know what I mean?.
